01 Expedition ABS malfunction due to windshield leak

[nolapj]

Good afternoon all,

I am hoping someone here will be able to help me because thus far my local dealership has not. I am looking for contact information for the Regional/Zone Manager for the Loiuisiana area or anyone else who would be able to help in resolving the latest electrical issue with our 01 Expedition. This latest electrical issue is with the Kelsey Hayes ABS module which has malfunctioned after a heavy rainstorm. The service manager at the dealership is stating that it was caused by a leak in the windshield and will require $900 + to repair not including the reseal of the windshield. With all the prior electrical gremlins we have experienced we have never seen evidence of water inside the vehicle or fuse box before. The service manager said that he has been in contact with the zone manager and that they can do nothing to resolve it and that we are going to have to pay to get the vehicle repaired. Our ESP coverage will not cover the repairs because they are due to a water leak (how convenient). The vehicle is still at the dealership. I have filed a complaint with both the NHTSA and the Ford Customer Realtionship Center but the CRC won't be calling back to follow up until Friday. I don't know where else to look for help.

Any advice/help/information that anyone would be able to provide me with will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

PJ

[Flyingjackal456]

hmmmm, I have never heard of something like this before. Was the rain hard enough to flood or was the car submerged under water? Is there water coming into the car? Get a garden hose and test for leaks yourself. Those ABS modules seem to fail often, but water damage shouldn't affect it.

As for advise, All I can say is do as much research as possible, if needed get a good lawyer, and See if you can find proof of water damage inside your fusebox. Please keep us updated on your case. Try going to another dealer and neglect to mention the water see what happen, see if they'll do the repair or see if they come up with the same diagnosis. In my experience, dealers hate warrantee work, you have to be a bigger pain-in-the-ass than they are.

Others will see this soon, hang in there and you might see more advice soon.

[mark v]

Best thing is I can say if you feel Ford is in the wrong maybe you should seek legal advise and let an expert in Automobile Law help you out.

[ZBlackBeast]

i agree with the above. I have never heard of water causing the ABS to freak out. I agree with flyingjackal456. Try and test for leaks around the area the ABS modi s held at. It could just be a weird freak accident that the abs was going to go out in the rain and the dealer is being a pain in the ass about it. i would take it to another dealer and get their opinion, and NOT memtion the rain. Thats about it.

[Flyingjackal456]

Yeah, really why would ABS go out in the rain, it is designed for inclement weather...

Good Luck man.

[TBIRD430]

The Ford customer assistance # should be in ur owners manual, get it and call them. They can connect u to ur area/region Ford Rep/Mgr....

[nolapj]

First of all I want to thank everyone who responded so far. Secondly I have to apologize for not clearly stating the entire issue in my initial post.

The vehicle has been back to this same dealership 5+ times since 2003 for strange electrical issues. Other than this currnet time, the last "major" electrical issue was in Dec 06 when the vehicle had ~66,500 miles on it (under the AWA). We had experienced heavy rain prior and when I started the vehicle the next morning of course the windshield wipers wouln't work nor would the interior lights (which was a repeat occurance along with the door locks working all by themselves). I let it idle for a while and bingo the wipers began to work all by themselves (it was still raining although not heavily). Well as I was driving to work the alarm system started to go haywire WHILE I was driving it (horn sounding & lights flashing). When I got to work I shut the truck off and the alarm continued to go off. One of my co-workers had to disconnect the battery and reconnect it to make it stop. A short time later I ran it up to the dealership, at this point the wipers were not working again nor was the radio. I left it there for 2 days onky to have the Tech report read "UNABLE TO DUPLICATE" yet again.

Fast forward to this latest occurance, once again after a period of heavy rain the truck wouldn't start. Checked fuse box for water and found nothingso we jumped it. It ran ok that except for the interior lights going on & off by themselves which had happened before as well. Parked it for the night and the next morning it wouln't start again (light rain / high humidity that night & morning) Anyway jumped it again and this time there was clicking/popping noise coming form engine comprtment. Narrowed to sound down to the black Kelsey-Hayes box and when we say the brake lines going in/out of it we immediately took it to the dealership. The ABS indicator had come on and was lit on the instrument panel the whole way to the dealer. Asked for tech to come out right when we got there to witness & verify the clicking/popping and he did. He said that it was most likely due to the windshield leak which caused water to get into the fuse box & GEM module which in turn sent electrical currnet to the ABS module causing the malfunction. This time the tech said they would test the windshield for leaks as well as check the fuse box & GEM module. Since the tech states water leak was the cause our FORD ESP Premium Extended warranty will not cover ithe repair work. And since vehicle now has 80000 and is over the 6 year mark it is also not eligible for the AWA (how convenient for them). I asked the Service Manager to give me the Zone Managers name and/or e-mail and he has refused. I instructed the dealer NOT to touch the truck and we will be picking it up this evening.

I think it is a shame that Ford Motor Company ahd no problem accepting our hard earned dollars when we made the choice to purchase their products yet again and our dealership had no issues accepting our money for all the routine scheduled maintenance we have had done on EITHER of our Fords but now has a problem with admitting their error which should have been addressed in Dec 06 and fixing it. We used to be loyal & proud Ford only owners. After this experience I am sorry to say "Not Anymore"

And as far as Ford Customer Relations Center, I will let read their reply and you be the judge as to their level of commitment to quality customer service.

-----Original Message-----
From: crcfmc@ford.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 22, 2008 4:05 PM
To: ********@*****.net
Subject: Ford Motor Company

Dear Patricia,

Feedback such as yours allows us to examine our practices and policies to ensure that we meet or exceed the expectations of our customers in the future. We regret that you have not had a favorable experience, and appreciate the time you have taken to write us.

Sincerely,
Louie
Customer Relationship Center
Ford Motor Company

For online support visit us at: Ask Ford what you are looking for which contains answers to frequently asked questions and links to other key product and service information.

[THREAD ID:1-3VJJII]

-----Original Message-----
From: *******@*****.net
Sent: 1/22/2008 08:10:52 AM
To: crcfmc@ford.com

Subject: RE: Ford Motor Company


Dear Ford Motor Company Customer Relationship Center,

Your prompt response is appreciated but unacceptable.

I will be forwarding both your response and Lamarque Ford's response to the Better Busines Bureau, as well as filing a formal complaint with both the National Highway Traffic Safety
Administration and the Louisiana Attorney General's Office for further review and action.

Sincerely,

Patricia H

-----Original Message-----
From: crcfmc@ford.com
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2008 8:59 PM
To: *******@c*****.net
Subject: Ford Motor Company


Dear Patricia

Thank you for contacting the Ford Motor Company Customer Relationship Center regarding the electrical concern on your 2001 Ford Expedition.

We have reviewed your situation, and there are no warranties, recalls or customer satisfaction programs on your vehicle that would provide assistance for this repair.

If you have any other inquiries, please feel free to contact us and we will be happy to address them for you.

Sincerely,
Louie
Customer Relationship Center
Ford Motor Company

For online support visit us at: Ask Ford what you are looking for which contains answers to frequently asked questions and links to other key product and service information.

[mark v]

Wow! nice response from Ford.

[Flyingjackal456]

wow, that definitely feels like a hand-written e-mail....I with Louie was an actual person, if he were he might have been of use to people that have actual problems.

We've all been screwed by Ford somewhere down the line, some are stupid easy fixes too. My 2002 Windstar needed a transmission computer update that Ford failed to acknowledge it as their fault, and they made me pay their ridiculous diagnostic and repair (a simple computer firmware update).


Please keep us posted and you may want to start calling up them lawyers

[ABE]

You are probably not going to like this response. I will play the devil's advocate here, because you have not shown it to be Ford's problem.

Statement of facts as you presented them:
1. You have had about 5 visits to the same dealership over a period of time with unusual electrical problems. Many of these problems involve components under the dash. These problems have occurred after and during heavy rain. They are not all resolved.
2. The current ABS problem stems from a component in the engine compartment, but the same dealer who has dealt with your previous problems, suggests that the GEM is sending electrical signals to the ABS and screwing the ABS up because of a leak in the windshield.
3. The leak in the windshield as the cause of the electrical problem voids the extended warranty.
4. You have not allowed the dealer to test the windshield for a leak and resolve the ABS and possibly GEM problem.
5. You have not taken the Expedition to another dealer for this ABS problem nor any of the previous problems.

From your standpoint:
1. There is no leak inside the Expedition, because the fuse box has no moisture and there is no evidence of water stains or damage to any part of the Expedition interior and particularly not to the dash general area.
2. You have not sought dealer confirmation that there is not a leak,
3. You have not sought a confirming diagnosis for any of the problems you have been having, and some seem to return when raining;
4. You have not sought a second opinion on the current ABS problem;
5. You keep going back to the same dealer who seemingly has never resolved anything for you.

While the diagnosis of the current ABS problem sounds odd and very unlikely, it is all that Ford have as factual info. You don't seem to have any info to provide them, just frustration. I fail to see why you should blame Ford for your predicament.

Take your Expedition to another dealer and get a second opinion on the diagnosis of your ABS problem. Don't waste your money on lawyers.

Sorry, but I believe the problem is yours.